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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 3, 2009 4:24:06 GMT -5
Unfortunately, it seems that the team got pulled into the war against Aizen.
A daring raid of Las Noches did recover the Hogyoku from Aizen's possession. Currently, it is being held in the Arcana Task Force, a place Aizen cannot track or find. This has set back Aizen's timetables and thus earned the help and trust of Soul Society. But it also attracted his wrath.
Not only does he dispatch Espada, Hollows and arrancar to harass the team wherever they go, but he has apparently put a major bounty on the team's head. He knows that enough demons, bounty hunters, and other assorted assholes will hunt the team down until they give back the Hogyoku.
Dealing with this is fairly difficult. The team could give BACK the Hogyoku... but there is a reasonable chance Aizen would still harass the team afterwards, just as punishment, and in any respect doing so would cause Soul Society to view the team as enemies and would actively contribute to evil. Giving the Hogyoku to Soul Society, meanwhile, would not only make the Hogyoku more vulnerable, but it would not solve the problem, as Aizen would still try to kill the team until they recovered the Hogyoku and returned it.
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Post by poisonuskeifer on Feb 17, 2009 0:43:12 GMT -5
Do we know where Aizen is? Maybe the best defense is a good offense in this case. Bring the fight to him as it were. Maybe we should also put out a bounty against Aizen?
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Post by GM on Feb 17, 2009 1:04:32 GMT -5
We already have in a sense. The team decided to stick dominique ferruk onto him. Dominique set a bounty out on him.
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Post by poisonuskeifer on Feb 17, 2009 1:19:20 GMT -5
Humm.. Well, my next question is this. We all know Aizen is a prick. But I am not too sure if he is a prideful prick. I mean, up until now, we have done well against the forces that Aizen has sent against us. Maybe we should act like we dont care. What if we stopped making a big deal about it and just acted like it was nothing and that what he was doing was totally stupid and pointless?
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Post by GM on Feb 17, 2009 3:11:44 GMT -5
We have been trying but he has been incredibly stubborn about this, we offered him a deal which he is considering but will probably refuse.
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Post by Scott Pilgrim on Feb 17, 2009 3:57:41 GMT -5
I agree with poisonus, the best defense in this case is a good offense, but for this I don't think just a good offense will cut it. We need a great offense, gather all our friends and allies, along with anyone who has a bone to pick with Aizen, and take that son of a bitch down.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 17, 2009 4:36:39 GMT -5
Aizen is in Las Noches, as far as we know. The problem is that getting to Las Noches is a bitch and a half.
Not to mention pit Sensui on him and stole his MacGuffin.
Aizen is not acting out of petulance or emotional responses. He is acting rationally.
You guys stole something from him. In the word he is in, such is a sign of weakness. He must prove that anyone who victimizes him will be in such a world of pain that your success should not be taken as a sign to do so again. Also, if he can, he'd get the item back. He's implied that he doesn't care too much about losing Orihime or the Hogyoku in the show, but that isn't the issue here. It's all game theory.
Now, as it so happens, so far he's proven that he will make things difficult for someone who steals from him, so he may have done his point. Fred and Mario sent Aizen a message to back off, and Aizen considered it, as long as we don't get involved with Soul Society's war.
Fred and Mario have a few different plans. They were considering returning a fake Hogyoku and making it into a bomb.
The problem with the blitzkrieg attack is a fewfold. A) We don't have intel. Las Noches is a interdimensional, shifting space with random corridors. Last time, we got lucky. We may not again. Further, Las Noches has recruited Kin, new Espada and Hollows... We don't know what his new force structure is. B) We don't have that much free energy to commit to that attack. We can't leave ourselves open. Aizen knows that if it comes down to it, we probably will pick the Arcana to fight instead of him. And it may come down to it.
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Post by Scott Pilgrim on Feb 17, 2009 4:58:47 GMT -5
Aizen is a smart guy, he will think of everything before we do, he would have already thought of a total bat shit crazy blitzkrieg, and passed over it just as quick because it's insane. That means he wont be expecting it, besides that we have very powerful friends(soul society and the corps to name a few), and he is a threat to all thing living, and dead, so the way I see it, our best choice would be to rally all our friends and allies and attack him with everything we have. I am sure with all the power we could rally we could break through to him, then we simply need someone who wouldn't be affected by his Zanpaktou, two wonderful candidates for that come to mind, Daredevil and Rot Lop Fan. Both of them are blind, and, like Tosen, unaffected by his release. There is also a race that is blind and see through the force, many jedi are of this race and would also be unaffected.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 17, 2009 5:58:51 GMT -5
I'm reminded of Thief: "Ah, but in being so prepared, might have you been too prepared to be prepared?" Yes, it's true that it has the merit of seeming to be stupid. But he actually has the forces for it to actually BE stupid. He's not too afraid of the possibility because it in fact is a bad move.
Remember that everyone's tried it already. First Ichigo's rescue team, then the rescue team for the rescue team, THEN what you guys just did. He's upgraded security. Actually, at this point something aside from the blitzkrieg would be unexpected.
Friends who themselves are busy. Soul Society already IS in a full-on war with Aizen. We can't magically appear and expect them to be able to launch an offensive; they already are and it's not working.
Fred is not willing to devote that much of the resources of the Arcana Task Force to take down Aizen. Expending that political and literal capital to take down Aizen means they can't use it against the Arcana, the real threat.
Already you are assuming that his bankai doesn't allow him to affect the blind, or that he doesn't have Vizard. Let alone that he himself can't summon his own allies (the Masters of Evil, the Evil League of Evil)... Not to mention that Aizen could probably kill Daredevil and Rot Lop Fan and then use his weapon without being interrupted on the rest of you. You're also assuming you can reach Daredevil and Rot Lop Fan.
Remember that these heroes are all locked in their own struggles. We drew some of Soul Society's aggro. But if we grab Daredevil away, then New York doesn't have someone to stop Stilt Man from attacking. Okay, Spider-Man can... but then the Rhino pulls off a heist. It takes timing and preparation, freeing people up so they can join up. And if Aizen anticipates this move, he can send his Espada to raise the costs to them.
You guys also DON'T have as much pull as you think. Yes, you're friends with maybe 30-50 excellent heroes. That doesn't mean you can get hundreds of people to make an impromptu army to go into a hellhole.
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Post by poisonuskeifer on Feb 17, 2009 14:13:26 GMT -5
Have you guys talked to Urahara about helping make the fake? I bet he could rig up something really nasty.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 17, 2009 14:54:05 GMT -5
We have yet to broach that somewhat uncomfortable matter. It IS talking about modifying his specialty. But we can ask. The problem isn't the idea of rigging up the fake, it's making one that will stand close observation to Aizen and that carries enough punch.
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Post by Scott Pilgrim on Feb 17, 2009 15:34:32 GMT -5
I am positive I could get a hold of Rot Lop Fan, he's a Green Lantern too, Ok technically he's the only member of the F-sharp Bell Corps, but that's becasue he's blind and could comprehend the concept of a "green lantern". Also, now with all the worlds the way they are New York is flooded with supers, Spiderman, The fantastic Four, The Avengers, the Justice Society, two other Green Lanterns, and The Outsiders. They've got plenty of protection. The matter of fact is we're going to have to fight him sometime or this is never going to end. The Rescue squad was a small force as was the backup squad and us when we went in there, I'm talking a god damn army, Get speed and numbers in our favor to such an insane degree that we can over power him. Our friends have friends, and did I mention that he's a threat to all living things, hell some super villains might even want to help because it's their ass on the line too.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 17, 2009 18:08:16 GMT -5
You might be able to send a MESSAGE to Rot Lop Fan. What you may not be able to do is secure his assistance. And the way all the worlds are, New York is also flooded with Spidey's rogue's gallery, the Justice Society's rogue's gallery, Daredevil's rogue's gallery, etc. Good guys bring their own bad guys. Yes, but he's now PREPARED for a mass army invasion. First, to get to Las Noches, one has to trek through Hueco Mundo. Hostile Hollows, Gillian, Vasto Lorde and natural arrancar come out of the woodwork in roughly the same proportion as the attackers. Any weaker or less endurant heroes might be killed by the crossfire. Once this massive army moves through hostile enemy territory, they encounter a palace that, once they enter, actively stymies their moves, sending in Aizen's Espada, Privaron and any mercenaries and bounty hunters he hires to pick off weaker enemies, splitting up the army, allowing attacks that can't be returned, etc. Further, what with the world the way it is, Aizen HIMSELF has done some upgrades. If a major attack like that occurs, he has agreements with enemy factions to attack the homelands of the assailants once they leave. There are tons more Hollows from all of the Kin dying, and Kin who serve him or serve allies of him. He's purchased automatic security from the Splugorth, Naruni, etc., using his vast wealth, the vast natural wealth of Hueco Mundo, and his ability to make people think they are being paid. Not to mention that if we pit all that, the Arcana will almost undoubtedly take advantage of the opportunity to abduct some of our members with THEIR massive force. And he can easily hire mercenary armies. Not to mention that Aizen's whole GOAL is to have all of the defenders gone in a spiritually powerful location so he can drop the bomb and get the King's Key! We could be playing right into his hand. Kevin can try if he wants, but Fred isn't going to be burning the political capital to do this. Kevin will be on his own, though Fred will help with whatever team Kevin gets. That having been said, Fred isn't opposed to doing something proactive. But, like real wars, it needs to be small skirmishes before the main invasion. Improve Soul Society somehow, give them an edge so Aizen loses more on a particular front. Find a way to heal Nel so an Espada can help us and give us their force information. Blow up towers, continue the work DF has done in fomenting a Hollow revolution, or somehow deal with a huge portion of his Hollows (maybe find some massive jar that we can fit tons of them in). Convince more Espada, Arrancar and Privaron to defect: After all, remember that many Espada fight for Aizen because he's fearless and doesn't believe in killing Hollows on sight, something that we could adopt as a practice. Rig a trap, or 'kite' Espada and elites to our enemies to take out two birds with one stone. Etc. EDIT: Fred DID, with Kevin's prompting, come up with something proactive. Turning to Kevin, he says, "Well, Kevin, I gotta give it to ya. You started me thinking on the devices we have around here, and there's this little baby, the Mammon Machine. Now, I've already set it up to do what it can do for you, Glenn, Marshall, Cassidy and Arexa." OOG: That's the subject of a PM I'm about to send. To repeat here: The Mammon Machine was a machine used by Zeal to channel Lavos' power. We're using it to channel other archetypal powers, like Bijuu, M'uru, Gojira, etc.Fred then turns it on. Grinding sounds are heard, then a vast spiritual sucking noise. It sounds like a thousand MPH typhoon. The room becomes pitch black as the Mammon Machine does its job, trapping forces. Soon, the Mammon Machine seems filled with shadow, black screeching forces heard emanating from it. "Taking DF's opening, I've trapped billions of Aizen's loyalist Hollows in this impromptu jail cell. Their struggles to get out and their energy produce unimaginable amounts of condensed reiatsu. We've turned that into artillery that we're firing at Aizen's positions. He himself has produced a barrier, but it's nonetheless starting. Even better, people who absorb power can top themselves off from this Hollow source. And we'll slowly try to convince the Hollows in there that we're the better alternative. This reduces his numbers. We'll agree to let some free if they stop aiding him, others if they join us, get a good array, we're not trying to imprison people with no rights of release."
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Post by poisonuskeifer on Feb 17, 2009 21:25:22 GMT -5
Dude, that is nasty Fred... Just fearsome...
You know, channeling Hellfire into that thing might help out as well. It seemed to be very affective against Espada.
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Post by GM on Feb 17, 2009 22:00:41 GMT -5
When Mario sees whats going on he will say "What the fuck did you do?"
"You have a reason why you didn't say anything to me before using our machine to capture all these hollow? You better not be using them to fuel your powers Fred or were gonna have a big problem here." Marios voice is dead serious.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 18, 2009 0:01:29 GMT -5
Agreed on the hellfire.
Fred says, "No, I didn't. The consensus here was clearly for doing something proactive and committing all of our resources to this. So far, people have approved, and I discussed with L, Kurama, Arexa, Redfox... Arexa insisted that we treat them like prisoners of war, so we are making sure there's enough spiritual energy for them to remain alive. I apologize if you feel out of the loop, but we have yet to acquire unanimous or even majority consent to use this in the past. And, no, we are consuming no Hollows, but Redfox, myself, Cory, Cassidy and Brian can eat the spare energy and any Hollow who, despite our best efforts, dies. Remember that in Hueco Mundo, they are constantly eaten by each other. This is actually safer than their homeworld, as messed up as that is, and no shinigami or Quincy will be blowing their heads off here. It's the humane approach, even as much as I hate denying freedom to sentient beings. Not to mention that this is the logical extension of DF's op, which you already signed off on.
So, now we have a weapon against Aizen, power for the base, a reduced number of Hollows, protected millions of sentient beings, and took prisoners of war, all in one shot."
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Post by GM on Feb 18, 2009 0:22:03 GMT -5
"Right except its partially my mammon machine and out of the ones who went and got it I am clearly the only one aside from you who care how its used additionally I didn't sign off for it to be used like this, logical extension or not do not let it happen again Fred end of discussion."
"Look all I am asking for is advanced warning so I can object before the fact instead of after, I hope that is not too much to ask.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 18, 2009 0:46:59 GMT -5
"Fair enough. You'll get advanced warning on any similar usage of the Mammon Machine. Now don't implicitly threaten ME again. You simply had to ask directly to have it set as a procedure for you to be informed in the future." Fred is just as matter-of-fact. "Now, hopefully this has caught Aizen's attention. Next, we might be able to put another one of our enemies into a nasty position. I'm considering 'informing' Sanctuary Eight about Aizen, publically. This would force them to act to deal with the threat to keep their cover."
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Post by GM on Feb 18, 2009 1:57:43 GMT -5
"You misunderstand me I am just trying to say I have become rather cross with the situation and am starting to dislike being walked upon I did not mean to threaten you."
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 18, 2009 2:08:44 GMT -5
"Fair enough. So, now we need to move onto the next phase. We may be able to auction these Hollows off and solve all of our problems, throw them in as a bargaining chip. We just have to make sure not to overplay our hand. But let's let him stew for a while, try to figure out what happened. Do you like my Sanctuary Eight idea?"
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Post by GM on Feb 18, 2009 2:15:15 GMT -5
"yeah lets do that help solve two problems at once, if they try to worm out of aizen it will help prove there fakes."
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 18, 2009 2:21:36 GMT -5
"Exactly. My only concern, though, is if they charge in guns blazing, they might kill an arrancar unnecessarily, and conversely some of them may die so we can't put them into jail, and they might then be made into Hollows. And I don't want to see Colonel Chaos' bankai. You know, the first arrancar with bankai."
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Post by GM on Feb 18, 2009 2:34:15 GMT -5
"Well in that case the risks outweigh the positives and we don't do it."
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 18, 2009 3:34:51 GMT -5
"Not necessarily. The op we suggest doesn't have to be guns blazing attack. We can again take advantage of their requirement to be good guys to do something we think they can do but which will weaken them, shake them up, and let us get info. Maybe capturing Espada, or training Soul Society, or something."
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Post by poisonuskeifer on Feb 22, 2009 15:28:40 GMT -5
"Or that other awful plan you haven't told us about yet. Though, I don't think we currently have the power to pull it off. Maybe if we did something sneaky, like travel into Aizen's dreams and use the device on his dreaming self?"
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 22, 2009 17:08:36 GMT -5
Fred says, "Other awful plan? I mean, I'm sure I have plenty, but I don't know which one you're referring to. As far as dreams go, I don't know if I'd trifle with someone with the power of hypnosis in the dream world."
OOG: Bear in mind that Deadpool training, while it does allow one to make OOG REFERENCES, doesn't allow one to have OOG KNOWLEDGE. Deadpool could make references to the real world, but he could not consistently use the knowledge of his nature as a comic book character to anticipate things he didn't know as a comic book character. Self-awareness of your true condition is not the same as predictiveness.
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Post by poisonuskeifer on Feb 22, 2009 17:44:18 GMT -5
"Humm... I think you might be right about that one Fred."
OOG: Oops, my bad. I think I understand the difference now. Though, in all honesty, everyone who plays with Fred knows that he has another awful plan up your sleeve. I shouldn't have mentioned anything specific though.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 22, 2009 18:16:06 GMT -5
"Besides, I wonders if he sleeps, what kind of protection he has... Another problem with the Sanctuary Eight plan is that we want to behave as if they are not the Slaughterhouse Seven, to indicate that we don't know (since we actually do). So we'd have to find a way to phrase the request that indicates that they really can't say no, but not in such a way as to cast suspicion on ourselves. All right, let's take a step back. We have some ideas of the ending gambit. And we've already done the opening gambit. So, this is a chess game. It's the middle game. That's the point where we trade pieces, open up the King for checkmate, put the king into Check in order to force our enemy to sacrifice pieces... Okay, I do have an idea. Might be difficult. But anyone have a problem with kidnapping?" OOG: Oh, yeah, I totally know and that was what Fred referenced in HIS response . Besides, Fred may have shared with you IC... but under condition of confidentiality.
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Post by GM on Feb 22, 2009 19:40:32 GMT -5
"Who and under what circumstances?" Mario mostly ignores what they were talking about.
OOG: this is what I was talking to you about Fred don't mention shit that people cant know about right in front of there face to read.
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Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Feb 22, 2009 19:53:21 GMT -5
"Tosen and/or Gin. Aizen admires them. We might be able to use them as bargaining chips to force him to back off. Assuming our plan is to get him to back off. We could try to rig some kind of energy harness to ride the giant cero we're firing at Las Noches, whittling down the battlements. Just hold them as hostages, not cruelly, not depriving food or what not. Our prisons just got upgrades for exactly this, and we can also threaten to hand them over to Soul Society to be held in the Maggot's Nest. And insofar as we can interrogate them, again according to standard legal procedure under the Geneva Convention, we can get information that could be vital to the war effort. That'd also be something we could secure Sanctuary Eight's help for: A very specific prisoner capture.
Of course, if we actually want to take this to the big house, finish off the situation, then we can't do that strategy. Or, rather, we could, but more for morale deprivation and to get rid of his lieutenants. If we want to actually go all-out, despite our pretense in negotiations, then we need something different. So far, we've been focusing on Espada. Maybe we could try to find a way to neutralize more of his ground troops, the Numeros, Privaron Espada and fraccion?
There's another point. A lot of Privaron Espada and natural arrancar resent Aizen's use of the Hogyoku. That could be another route in."
OOG: Well, unfortunately this was the place to fix the situation.
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