|
Post by tenthousandcuts on Nov 8, 2006 17:32:32 GMT -5
this is stupid I agree with sera you should ask people to post if they want there charecters to be used... not if they do not want to be used.
|
|
|
Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Nov 8, 2006 19:39:18 GMT -5
I figured they did ask you to, but in general I like to hear from the people directly. In actual practice, I have stuck only to using characters who I figured would not mind (primarily, Kyle, Justin, James, and Cory's characters have featured prominently... and I just remembered, Barret did not get an execution scene or any action; darniot, gotsa re-edit that story). If you don't like the way a character is depicted, I can remove them post facto from the story easily enough; no harm, no foul. Alternatively, I can edit the strategy and depiction used. I find these complaints incredibly disingenuous for a few reasons. 1) Ultimately, the characters depicted are depicted as using strategy, skill and ability. It's a POSITIVE showcase, not a negative one. (More on that later). 2) The complaints have included two separate copyright concepts, mutually exclusive yet being argued simultaneously. First Mario has claimed that, in essence, the ownership resides in the character creator. This is actually the one I agree with: The ingenuity and independent style of the character CREATOR is the relevant criterion, since they were the ones who actually put in the requisite time, energy and creativity to generate this unique figure. The fact that they made it in someone else's world is largely irrelevant. Fair enough. This implies, of course, that those creators then have veto power as to others' depictions of their concepts. However, Mario then proceeds to say that I can't use anyone from ITM, even those who have opted into having their character concept used. Now Mario is, simultaneously, arguing that a GM has total control AND players have total control. Which is it, dudes? If it's GM control, then I can feature all complainants' FB, CotG, Janus Vertice, Heroes Unlimited, Endless Horizons, High Noon, Destroy All Monsters, TMNT, YYH, Rifts (every one but Xeno's prospective campaign), etc. character to no complaints, but can't feature my D&D, ITM, Fire Emblem, etc. characters in my own stories. If it's player control, then Mario's claim is a totally imperial one to expand the domain of his intellectual property. It means that GMs then have veto power over characters used in their campaign to appear in non-campaign works, despite the fact that they did no work (in the majority of cases) in creating the character. I was relatively good-natured about the complaints until THAT one got tried. Which is it, folks? Does Mario own your ITM characters or do you? It can't be both. 3) No one here has had their character used (Hunter, Xeno, Sera, Mario or Tenthousandcuts). The exception is Nether, who has not posted her complaint, and underneath Mario's system of GM ownership would have no right to complain. (To be clear: If Nether does complain about Deva/Kin's depiction, I will remove Deva from the story). 4) Not to be a dick legally, but a good number of the characters created here could not qualify for any legal copyright whatsoever, as both the contininuities from which they derive (i.e. Fire Emblem, Janus Vertice, etc.) and the ability sets that they use (i.e. ITM trainers, homages to anime characters, etc.) are so derivative as to clearly be infringing on legally existing copyright. While all of you of course have the right to keep your characters from being used... (well, sort of, I mean the right as given by this site because you have no legal recourse), I'm really disappointed that egos and tempers are flaring on this totally innocuous score. The stories have been attempts to highlight the great diversity of play at work in the site. It has actually INCREASED interest in virtually every game from which characters are featured, since people say "Man, how can I get in on that?" It has made people honestly view how much creativity there is at work among the good members of this fine board, how much diversity there is among those playing in all the various games, and generally been a way to stoke everyone's badass fires. Hell, technically I could write a story where a CotG character appears and everyone dies from aura damage, since that's the power strata that CotG works in. Instead I've made sure to highlight the many cool abilities that these various characters have at their disposal. If the fear is that I won't accurately depict the characters or play them appropriately, that's fine, though I have noticed a decent amount of leeway given by these very people to other GMs (or even myself) to NPC them or railroad them along and thus presume behavior patterns and so on. I then submit that those who are afraid simply consult me and tell me what their characters would do, particular lines or behavior patterns, etc. What I suspect is actually the fear is bruised egos, which I can understand of course but I think it's ultimately counter-productive to the interests of the site and characters. Seriously, people, it's just friggin roleplaying characters. If any of you have any hope of writing, your characters will be featured in thousands of derivative doujinshi, lemon and yaoi stories, fanfics, etc. all of which will probably be INFINITELY less favorable than the depictions here. Even people with the actual law on their side who make millions off their products are less protected than the protections I'm giving people here, so chillax. Anyways: Sera, Hunter, Xeno, and Ten Thousand are not going to be featured
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Nov 8, 2006 20:53:31 GMT -5
damn whiners, so any way when the hell sm i gettin mine
|
|
|
Post by Bob_12 on Nov 10, 2006 5:22:13 GMT -5
I must say that my only complaint would be if you used Bob_12 himself in a story without first asking my permission.
Well, or if you tried to see something with my characters in it.
Otherwise, whatever goes, goes.
Oh, and I think Bob_12 would kick some major ass, by the way.
|
|
|
Post by songstress on Nov 10, 2006 11:32:11 GMT -5
well you see we dont really have a problem with you using most of our other charecters (save our into the mix ones as they our ourselves and we want you to ask our permission first not just use them then take them out if we do not like that) we just want you to ask before you put them in the story that is all... and mario meant that you shouldnt use them unless you asked the person not whether or not you asked him.
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Nov 10, 2006 11:44:03 GMT -5
see fred recently explained this to me, he uses characters that together might have a chance against a cotg opponent, not because he believes them to be cannon fodder and worthy of extermination
|
|
|
Post by songstress on Nov 10, 2006 14:04:20 GMT -5
yeah but from my expection and interpretation that isnt possible no amount of charecters on this site could really take a cotg charecter it just wouldnt and besides that has nothing to do with what I am saying.
|
|
|
Post by Black Fox on Nov 10, 2006 15:05:00 GMT -5
I have stuck only to using characters who I figured would not mind (primarily, Kyle, Justin, James, and Cory's characters have featured prominently-Fred
now add me to that list i dont mind at all and would actually encourage the use of my characters in your stories so add me to the list of people who dont care, not like it actually happens, its a story, i see no reason to get but hurt, but i agree that if someone doesn't want their character in a story, they should CIVILY ask not to have it featured in further stories. not complain and whine about it its not that big of a friggin deal, you just need to be like' hey i would not like my characters shown in future cotg ass kicking stories, but if you want to ask me for a specific character go ahead and do so.
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Nov 10, 2006 15:13:55 GMT -5
damn whiners
|
|
|
Post by Black Fox on Nov 10, 2006 15:30:47 GMT -5
um...your also forgetting, strategy, is it not possible to defeat an 'immortal' deamon with characters from normal powered games. i mean jesus christ i know this better than most i survived the unsurvivable scenario in V37, i give alot of that credit to my teammates in that game, and if you inteligently strategize instead of spending so much damm time on how cool your character looks, i mean jesus christ Derrick nothing very special about him, he wears converse, slacks, a dress shirt suspenders and a friggin tie, hes got a jacket too. and i dont need to sit there and describe my exact movements and how cool i want him to look, i would much rather role play in things, let fred decide the exact mechanics of the actual battle and what happens, and i will tell him what i want to do. i try to play strategically. I think it would be possible to defeat a CotG character with a team of normal powered characters, and im sure fred would agree with me on this point. It may not be the easiest thing, but it would be worth it. so dont count out the power of a good strategy against an overly powerful opponent.
|
|
hunter
Superhuman
no I dont want your number alright!!
Posts: 57
|
Post by hunter on Nov 10, 2006 15:48:23 GMT -5
yeah I find it in almost no way possible that normal charecters could beat cotg charecters unless Fred let us... I mean come on I get what your saying but be reasonable here is there any charecter you have that can survive the dimension they are in being blown up? literally fuckin erased? if so then I do not quite count that as a "normal" game that is another high powered game.
it might be possible to defeat a cotg chaecter with a normal charecter but the odds are practically non existant.
also to further prove my point look at the title and the first sentence.
Okay look this is what I am seeing basically.
multiple people: we think you should ask people before hand to use there charecters as that is better than writing the story then having to take people out.
fred: no I want to do it my way
multiple people: why?
fred: because I show them using strategy
multiple people: what does that have to do with what where saying?
hack: fricken whiners
really just pm them and ask if you can use there charecters the people you mentioned should say yes anyway so why does it matter it saves your ass from being complained too and it makes everyone happy.
|
|
|
Post by Black Fox on Nov 10, 2006 15:54:51 GMT -5
and their you are giving up, i never said it would be easy, but it is possible, and alot of people are gonna die or be sacrificed, i mean look at the things CotG characters fight...spekkio, you dont kill him he stops the fight, but other things like they have to have teams to fight, think of the CotG teams as the normal character, and the Transgressive beast for example as the actual CotG character, we are able to beat the TB, couldn't it work just the same way, you have to rely on ingenuity, and strategy, you have to have something that provides a punch, these stories are meant to show the CotG characters kicking ass, they aren't invicible, they are able to be killed incapacitated, or stop the fight, just as some of their enemies have done. I think chances are low, but they aren't zilch.
|
|
hunter
Superhuman
no I dont want your number alright!!
Posts: 57
|
Post by hunter on Nov 10, 2006 15:58:26 GMT -5
no again because the gap isnt as big.
example: lets just say transsgressive beast is high cosmic. diffenece is transgressive to cosmic
these are normal to transsgressive.
the difference of the first is 1 rank
the difference of the second is 3 ranks.
I agree its possible but not really too plausible or realistic.
|
|
|
Post by Black Fox on Nov 10, 2006 16:03:14 GMT -5
but your ignoring the point that it is possible, i even stated that it wouldn't be a cake walk, and i also stated that alot of the team would die, it is still however possible.
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Nov 10, 2006 17:47:33 GMT -5
he also told me that in order for an epic character to even harm a COTG character he or she would need to sucessfully feint and nail a critical hit, but then again that was to inflict noticable damage to hack
|
|
|
Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Nov 10, 2006 18:41:22 GMT -5
Ooops, forgot to mention ya, Colin. I did indeed use your characters from the getgo.
Actually, no character is going to be able to take CotG characters, though some Epic level D&D, stronger FB teams, etc. may be able to do some damage. That's absolutely not the point. Were I to be lampooning the "victim" characters, it would be apparent in the style of writing, the description, etc. Instead, what I'm doing is showcasing characters in a difficult position, fighting an absolutely superior foe who is for all intents and purposes invulnerable, and showing their attempts to nonetheless use their available resources for maximal effect. It's like when the Beyonder exterminated the New Mutants. If someone doesn't walk away from that comic with a greater respect for the New Mutants, I don't know what depiction would increase their respect.
Colin: "Impossible" opponents in V37 are nothing but. They usually have a fatal weakness, an ability to be defeated through a puzzle or through access to a special weapon, or are within what I'd call the same Tier as the character. Indeed, in most continuities (TV shows, anime, etc.) we see moments where super-powered foes are defeated by much weaker enemies. When Pippin kills the Nasgul or Frodo destroys Sauron by bringing the ring to Mount Doom, we see overlords of almost Satanic power being defeated by small halflings. So, yes, sometimes it is possible to destroy enemies with far more resources than you, with pluck, courage, skill and strategy. However, CotG characters really are a level above in a variety of domains: Not just raw power but complexity of power, lack of obvious weaknesses, equipment, etc. Since the basic CotG character has just for playing numerous spells that were literally forbidden to be cast by the universe itself and a planet-destroying spaceship bug at their disposal, the average CotG character has numbers equivalent to Sauron, raw destructive power equivalent to Majin Buu, more techniques than Kakashi, fewer weaknesses than Juggernaut, speed and attack spamming ability equal to the Flash, and more weapons and money than Batman. That doesn't exactly open up easy strategies. The chance of even a team composed of one person from EVERY OTHER GAME ON THE SITE (that'd be ITM, Fire Emblem, Darkseid, Demon Unleashed, Naruto, every FB team, Janus Vertice, etc. etc.) beating a CotG character is in the one in a trillion category (would need all 100s for the team and all 1s for the CotG character alongside masterful strategy). Nothing is impossible per se, just so staggeringly unlikely that it probably is impossible.
ITM characters I have adopted the rule that I will ask permission before using, for obvious reasons. If that was the way the request had been phrased on Mario's part, I wouldn't have been as offended. The way it was phrased was not as a defense but as an outright ban, which he doesn't have the right to do anymore than I believe I have the right to write character concepts that have been created in or ported to my games. If anyone had been paying attention before launching complaints, they would have seen that Krystal was the first ITM character used, and that was because I had asked her.
By noticeable damage, I meant something like 10 out of 9999. You'd immediately regenerate it.
If people want me to ask permission first, alter your "Nos" to "Don't until permission is granted". I hope that everyone sees that the two are totally different. This is also why I've given Hack, Ash, Bob_12 and cerpin (Tim) the ability to choose their victims or for people to nominate victims for them in this next iteration.
|
|
|
Post by Black Fox on Nov 10, 2006 20:13:19 GMT -5
hmmm, well i guess i was wrong about the power level, and i knew my scales were different, but oh well. i was trying to defend a moot point. but at least i tried
|
|
|
Post by doomkitty on Dec 31, 2006 3:39:12 GMT -5
fred can you do me next please?
could you do a dual between my 4 chars?
dengar and yayoi VS Duuz and Mac
that would be great or anything you can throw at me would be good!
|
|
|
Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Jan 2, 2007 14:45:16 GMT -5
Not technically an asskicking story, but I'll see what I can do
|
|
|
Post by sithofmacabre on Jan 2, 2007 20:00:47 GMT -5
I give full-on-go-ahead permission to use my characters.
'cause...jeez, getting killed by a powerful cotg is, if not gruesome, cool.
I mean...I was killed by my own character XD
I volunteer whatever other characters I have to be killed.
Show me some power!!! That's the purpose of these storiesss.
|
|
|
Post by zeebedee on Jan 3, 2007 13:42:17 GMT -5
I'd like to see a battle between Chosen and Zenexoria!
Asskicking story.....
Using my "Glenn" Character (The one that can do energy blasts out of any orifice or area of his body) I took down a green gigas single handedly, ev en though I wasn't really (in my opinion) strong enough to.
We were trapped in a cave, and I kept firing at him, using the power of the blasts to knock me away to safety. ^^
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Jan 3, 2007 14:33:02 GMT -5
when's my peeps showing up here
|
|
|
Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Jan 3, 2007 20:11:01 GMT -5
PC v. PC I like to do in actual dual form.
When I write them, Hackioso.
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Jan 4, 2007 11:27:05 GMT -5
oh god, this is gonna be destructive
|
|
|
Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Jan 6, 2007 21:01:32 GMT -5
Pick some people you'd like to kill.
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Jan 8, 2007 19:04:54 GMT -5
just evil shit in general, that seems to be the only universal desire for destruction among my party
|
|
|
Post by Mace Parshath on Jan 11, 2007 18:13:00 GMT -5
*Blinks* Wow, this thread sure did turn into a slug-fest until recently. Thank goodness too, I was even beginning to get offended at how people were treating Fred. O.o; But anywho. Fred, if you want to use my characters, you have my permission to do so, and with my good graces included.
|
|
|
Post by draco on Jan 13, 2007 9:50:49 GMT -5
Fred, I must see a Shae story. If you get a chance, please work one up for me.
|
|
|
Post by Frederic Bourgault-Christie on Jan 14, 2007 16:26:10 GMT -5
Hack: I meant in the context of an asskicking story, which means people from around the site.
Draco: Sure!
|
|
|
Post by Vincent Hack on Jan 15, 2007 13:41:01 GMT -5
well i really don't care who i beat the crap out of, though you might need everyone'scharacters just to look good against my full party
|
|